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Author Subject: Bad day on the rollers!
chunder27

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Location: Stevenage

Registered: 09 Apr 2013

Posts: 151

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Post #1
First time poster but not a first time car I think

Blue track car, guys called Tom used to have it? I have done a day at Snett and it handled lovely but felt a little sluggish. But I have never driven one before so I didn't really know if it was me.

OK ran it on rollers near Aylesbury, rollers are reputable, a few mates have had solid runs and accurate figures there.

Car is an 01 GTI-6, totally standard apart from a horrid powerflow which will be going soon lol! Too old for all that racket!

Now, I was horrified to only get 138 flywheel bhp, well down on standard. I would have expected a small drop off on a 90k motor but not 30hp.

Car is well looked after, serviced well, nothing obvious, no oil burn, CO was fine from lambda readings so not overly rich or lean, doesn't miss or anything. I was runnin Momentum which might be a bit tough on standard ECU but shouldn't make that much difference.

Only issue was a small pipe from the main cold air feed was split meaning a loss of air maybe. Pic attached, (sorry for file size Iphone noob!!)

Other than that suggestions have been timing, a blocked injector? cambelt was only done in Nov so possible bad fitment? Maybe this air filter etc is an issue?

I live in Stevenage, any Pug friendly forum garages that are close to here? Might pop down to ACe if someone wants a peek!

Great forum guys, so much cool help here
Posted 19th May 2013 at 20:01
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

Registered: 27 Mar 2007

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Post #2
check the throttle cable, and that it actually is a gti6 engine...

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Posted 19th May 2013 at 20:02
stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

Location: Kent

Registered: 18 Jan 2004

Posts: 21,768

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Post #3
Welcome to the club! Wave

Your issues sound like slightly off cam timing to be honest. Yes

It's very easy to do on these engines, and as you say it felt a bit sluggish on the trackday.
Personally, I would check the cam timing, change the plugs and make sure that the old ones look ok and not too rich or lean and look at what air filter you have. Open air filters tend to suffer with heatsoak. Yes

Good luck! Smile

________________________________________

"Supercharged - 454.1bhp/317.5lb/ft"
Peugeot 306 GTi-6
2000 (X), Moonstone Love
Posted 19th May 2013 at 20:07
stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

Location: Kent

Registered: 18 Jan 2004

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Post #4
welshpug! wrote:
and that it actually is a gti6 engine...


That...is a very good suggestion. Yes

________________________________________

"Supercharged - 454.1bhp/317.5lb/ft"
Peugeot 306 GTi-6
2000 (X), Moonstone Love
Posted 19th May 2013 at 20:08
blandy

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Location: Bucks

Registered: 25 Feb 2007

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Post #5
Which rollers did you use near aylesbury?
Posted 19th May 2013 at 20:46
mattgti6phase2

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Location: inside my 6 abusing the tarmac!!

Registered: 16 Jul 2010

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Post #6
If DSA rollers then they are s**te Dunno

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Posted 19th May 2013 at 21:27
chunder27

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Location: Stevenage

Registered: 09 Apr 2013

Posts: 151

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Post #7
I did use DSA actually, througha friend who had a decent result? Boke didn't know too much about these though.

To be honest I am new to these cars, and the horror show of knowing even its the right engine I wouldn't have a clue!

Is there an easy tell!!

I am thinking cam timing, am not a grease monkey so wouldn't have a clue about spannering! Might have to find a friendly garage somewhere nearby!

Thanks for the tips though, throttle cable deffo is a good one!

Wrong engine is bad lol!
Posted 19th May 2013 at 21:48
mattgti6phase2

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Post #8
the rollers at DSA are probably dusty they get such little use LOL so I wouldn't take the results from there as gospel.

As for the throttle cable there is an adjuster pin which if incorrectly set will only open the throttle 75% or less even though your foot is flat to the floor. As regards the cam timing i wouldn't have thought it could be that far out without causing considerable damage to the engine as the tolerances in these engines are pretty fine.

Knowing if you have the RFS (GTI6) engine is also easy to tell just look on google and plenty of pics will come up Thumbs up

________________________________________

Team Nile 6 Superman
Team: 40.2 MPG Smile
5 x a 306 owner!
currently abusing type r's in a town near you ™ Wink
I truely live for the 306 ®
Build date: 29th October 1997 Wednesday's car
midweek madness Tee hee
Posted 19th May 2013 at 23:27
armzsc6

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Location: Crowborough

Registered: 22 Mar 2008

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Post #9
Had mine on rollers at AMD in essex which are very accurate as they have race teams using them. cam timing was out enough that once i removed the engine and took the head off, the inlet valves had been just about kissing the tops of the pistons.

this was some years ago and it still made 158bhp running on vpower with straight through exhaust and induction after 120,000 plus miles. There was a big flat spot at 3-4k and it made all of its power at the limiter when it should be a fair bit lower.
Yet to hear one of these engines make that little power to be honest. Do some research on crank pulley failure before you get the belt timing checked Thumbs up. Also as said a set of plugs and a service wouldn't go a miss.

________________________________________

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Posted 19th May 2013 at 23:50
phillipm

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Location: Rotherham

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Post #10
Wouldn't be the first 'gti6' I heard of making 130bhp that actually turned out to be an xsi motor LOL:

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Posted 20th May 2013 at 00:12
rich306

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Post #11
Sounds like an Xsi !! Thats pretty much the hp mine made years ago!

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Posted 20th May 2013 at 06:36
roland rat

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Location: Swansea

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Post #12
Think this is the one that I sold to yippiekayay whom then sold it to tom28

When I sold it the headgasket was on its way out so whom evers done it hasn't got the timing spot on I'd say
Posted 20th May 2013 at 07:08
chunder27

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Location: Stevenage

Registered: 09 Apr 2013

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Post #13
You are right roland

Had some great feedback and help, was a little worried reading back some of Toms posts about messing with cam timing etc, I just wanna standard "milk float" for a bit of easy track work, she handles like a beaut!

Well travelled old Hector then? For an XSI !
Posted 20th May 2013 at 09:58
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

Registered: 27 Mar 2007

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Post #14
look at the gearbox end of the head, does it have a vacuum pump and RS cast into the head under it, 135 engine has 10 cast there, 1.8 has 7.

________________________________________

need a part number? get on here - http://public.servicebox.peugeot.com

Bring on the Trumpets.

Posted 20th May 2013 at 10:11
chunder27

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Location: Stevenage

Registered: 09 Apr 2013

Posts: 151

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Post #15
So being a numbnut here

If it hasnt got a 10 or a 7 there it is a pukka gti6 engine!

Or something like a 205 1.1

or a diesel!
Posted 20th May 2013 at 11:33
chunder27

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Registered: 09 Apr 2013

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Post #16
Well am certainly a little more relieved, seems I do have a pukke GTI-6, so onwards and upwards with whats wrong with the damn thing!
Posted 21st May 2013 at 08:15
adam b

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Post #17
Can you post a picture of the graph? What is the full spec of the thing?

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Posted 21st May 2013 at 20:19
chunder27

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Location: Stevenage

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Post #18
Hay adam, the car is totally standard apart from a powerflow back pipe from the cat. If it has any more mods I don't know about them.

Too bloody noisy!

It is a decent curve actually, picks up a bit at 3500 rpm, then tails off just after 6, which is what it felt like on track.

Just low power, 138, and torque was about 120.
Posted 21st May 2013 at 20:26
mattgti6phase2

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Post #19
That is so low! Loss of compression then is say!!!!

________________________________________

Team Nile 6 Superman
Team: 40.2 MPG Smile
5 x a 306 owner!
currently abusing type r's in a town near you ™ Wink
I truely live for the 306 ®
Build date: 29th October 1997 Wednesday's car
midweek madness Tee hee
Posted 21st May 2013 at 21:28
smithers

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Post #20
Could it have been entered incorrectly as is 138 not about right for an ATW figure? And should the power not tail off around 6250. Dunno

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Posted 21st May 2013 at 21:32
chunder27

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Location: Stevenage

Registered: 09 Apr 2013

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Post #21
Well the power did tail off around that area, and sadly the wheels figure was even lower. I was delighted when I saw the figure initially as I thought that's not bad at wheels! Bugger

Am going to do some digging soon I hope, but as I don't drive it daily its fine as it is!

Could be compression, could be cam timing, if its comp its likely gasket or something, which sucks ass.

Doesn't use much water but sadly rad was not full when I checked even though it runs cool, so doesn't look great from that point of view. But no mayo or oily smell in water. but it uses water not freeze which again is not a great sign.
Posted 21st May 2013 at 22:01
yippeekayay

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Location: wilts

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Post #22
I wouldlook atthe fact tom fitted a cam belt at cg cars before sale after stating my Peugeot main dealer mechanic didnt know how to set a cambelt up... Wouldnt be at all suprised itsbeen set up wrong again as its had 3 belts on it in last 3 years, and for the record I will bet the second belt was right as it went like a scorned cat unlike when I had it with the timing out...

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306 less for first time in nearly 7 years. Lets keep it that way... please refuse any offers i make to buy your 306 ( doctors letter supplied by request)

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Posted 21st May 2013 at 22:09
mattgti6phase2

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Location: inside my 6 abusing the tarmac!!

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Post #23
But could the timing be out that much without damaging the engine? I think it's have shat itself by now.

Compression being low could very easily be the cause for that's sauce power loss. We're talking 29bhp Shock

________________________________________

Team Nile 6 Superman
Team: 40.2 MPG Smile
5 x a 306 owner!
currently abusing type r's in a town near you ™ Wink
I truely live for the 306 ®
Build date: 29th October 1997 Wednesday's car
midweek madness Tee hee
Posted 21st May 2013 at 22:22
chunder27

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Location: Stevenage

Registered: 09 Apr 2013

Posts: 151

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Post #24
I am aware that a belt was changed recently, quite why 3 were changed in that time I don't know, whats the mileage on them!!

AS I said before a guy from here has said he will check out a few basic things for me, so will hopefully know more then.

I would have though timing out would cause a fairly obvious problem with bent vales, etc etc, but I am no spannerman
Posted 21st May 2013 at 22:31
adam b

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Post #25
Not necessarily, you can probably retard it enough to do that. Advance can get 14+ lbft but you are really close on the margins.

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Nothing to see here
Posted 21st May 2013 at 23:15

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