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Author Subject: Longer drop links for lowered car?
jeffers Forum Admin

Location: Leeds

Registered: 14 Dec 2003

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Post #26
welshpug! wrote:
Err nope, arb bushes are round inside.

Unless you alter the travel extremes the droplink is still operating within its designed window, so theres no need to change them.

No offence to anyone whos commented on this but.... Finally someone whos talking sense! i thought i was losing the plot! Roll eyes

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Posted 16th Aug 2013 at 08:12
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Rich E Forum Admin

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Post #27
When you lower a 306 the droplink mounting tab moves further away from the subframe, where the ARB is mounted to. Now, if you've ever looked at a front ARB you might have noticed that it has arms on the ends and does not pivot around the droplink mounting point.

Keeping the existing droplink forces the ARB to pivot upwards, which changes the angle that the droplink is operating at, which in turn changes the angles that the droplink balljoints are operating at. This leads to greater forces of deflection being applied through the joints which can lead to increased wear or failure of the joints.

Using a longer droplink allows operation much closer (or exactly the same) as the OEM ARB and droplink geometry.

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Posted 16th Aug 2013 at 08:27
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jeffers Forum Admin

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Post #28
Rich E wrote:
When you lower a 306 the droplink mounting tab moves further away from the subframe, where the ARB is mounted to. Now, if you've ever looked at a front ARB you might have noticed that it has arms on the ends and does not pivot around the droplink mounting point.

Keeping the existing droplink forces the ARB to pivot upwards, which changes the angle that the droplink is operating at, which in turn changes the angles that the droplink balljoints are operating at. This leads to greater forces of deflection being applied through the joints which can lead to increased wear or failure of the joints.

Using a longer droplink allows operation much closer (or exactly the same) as the OEM ARB and droplink geometry.

Right i see what ur saying...... now you've explained what you mean. All this talk about the distance between the shock tab and the ARB changing wasnt working in my mind as i was thinking the ARB still pivots from the same point therefore the distance would remain the same as its relative to each side. Although i must admit i never thought about the angle of the mounting tab on the end of the ARB.... depending on how low your car is though its not necassarily needed to fit longer links im sure... mines been on the same metal drop links for 6 years and they've been off several times and still do what they say on the tin! Oh and Rich, Nice Edit! Thumbs up

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Posted 16th Aug 2013 at 08:37
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Rich E Forum Admin

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Post #29
Ha, I though maybe that was a bit harsh!

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Posted 16th Aug 2013 at 08:37
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jeffers Forum Admin

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Post #30
Rich E wrote:
Ha, I though maybe that was a bit harsh!

Lol No offence taken anyway, im a bit thicker skinned than that! Wink

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Posted 16th Aug 2013 at 08:39
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welshpug!

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Post #31
Or just bend the arb Razz

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Posted 16th Aug 2013 at 08:50
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allanallen

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Post #32
Just to clarify, how low are you running your cars to find this an issue? And are you saying this just causes drop links to wear quicker?
I'm not convinced (on a sensibly lowered car) at all that longer drop links will help, if they're lasting longer it's probably because youre using a better link.

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Posted 16th Aug 2013 at 10:07
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Niall

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Post #33
allanallen wrote:
All lowering does is sit the arb at a different angle, no extra strain on anything. The only location the arb has is to stop it moving sideways, nothing to stop it pivoting in it's bushes which it's meant to be able to do.


But the point is, at standard height, the bolts on the drop links will sit at 90 degrees to the drop link its self then obviously pivot as the shock is compressed. If you lower the car, it will sit with the bolt pivoted constantly and when the shock is compressed, pivot it even further, possibly further than its designed to causing damage.
Posted 16th Aug 2013 at 10:00
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allanallen

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Post #34
Niall wrote:
allanallen wrote:
All lowering does is sit the arb at a different angle, no extra strain on anything. The only location the arb has is to stop it moving sideways, nothing to stop it pivoting in it's bushes which it's meant to be able to do.


But the point is, at standard height, the bolts on the drop links will sit at 90 degrees to the drop link its self then obviously pivot as the shock is compressed. If you lower the car, it will sit with the bolt pivoted constantly and when the shock is compressed, pivot it even further, possibly further than its designed to causing damage.


It's just a ball joint, as long as it's not running out of travel it won't wear any differently, yes it will have different forces acting on it but I'd say that they're negligible.

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Posted 16th Aug 2013 at 10:09
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beez_neez_gt

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Post #35
At the end of the day, I would prefer the ARB to sit in its natural position like OE. If not surely the bushes would wear in a different area thus wears out even more ?

Maybe you should all agree to disagree, this discussion always seems to repeat itself.

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Posted 16th Aug 2013 at 15:19
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jimmyhackers

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Post #36
ive had 2 306s on coilovers at around 50mm lowering. needless to say i didnt encounter this problem.

could be that i used new arb drop link arms each time. older droplink joints could be half knackered already causing them to break if reused under new higher stresses.

either way you'll need new drop links as youve broke em. might aswell got for adjustable drop links. just another thing to tinker with.

i doubt the difference is that noticable, the standard 306 ARB doesnt seem to do much.
and thats based on my 1.4 306 handling 10 times better on budget coilovers and no antiroll bar (was waiting for new DL arms) compared to the old oem suspension setup with anti roll bar attached.

i figure if youve lowered yor car 30mm then those 307 dl arms are fine. got for plastic over metal if this is the case. if you havnt gone close to 30mm lower then you may need adjustables.

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Posted 22nd Aug 2013 at 01:35
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phillipm

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Post #37
allanallen wrote:

It's just a ball joint, as long as it's not running out of travel it won't wear any differently, yes it will have different forces acting on it but I'd say that they're negligible.


Balljoint wear is generally exponential to it's operating angle.

However, lowering the car 30mm or so wouldn't have me worrying about the length.

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Posted 22nd Aug 2013 at 15:35
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jimmyhackers

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Post #38
jimmyhackers wrote:

i doubt the difference is that noticable, the standard 306 ARB doesnt seem to do much.
and thats based on my 1.4 306 handling 10 times better on budget coilovers and no antiroll bar (was waiting for new DL arms) compared to the old oem suspension setup with anti roll bar attached.




id say coilover with arb attached was about 11 times better than an old oem setup

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Posted 22nd Aug 2013 at 01:42
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stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

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Post #39
My car is lowered by 40mm and I've had no trouble with the drop links. They have been installed since 2008 (plastic ones) and I would say they've covered 20k in that time without issue. Smile

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Posted 22nd Aug 2013 at 23:06
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anth

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Post #40
Jesus Christ you look like a gimp in that avatar if that's you.
Posted 22nd Aug 2013 at 23:27
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beez_neez_gt

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Post #41
S & M dude or what lol.

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Posted 23rd Aug 2013 at 00:19
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beez_neez_gt

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Post #42

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Pug fee`ver,

Pick a Bogey, buy a Pug.

Black 306 GTI 6 Standard, was 60k mileage, bargain!!

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Posted 23rd Aug 2013 at 03:38
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stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

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Post #43
anth wrote:
Jesus Christ you look like a gimp in that avatar if that's you.


Cheers, just what I always wanted. LOL

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Posted 23rd Aug 2013 at 09:13
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buzzbrightyear

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Post #44
anth wrote:
Jesus Christ you look like a gimp in that avatar if that's you.

That's what I said!
Stans not noticed my profile pic mods yet

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Posted 24th Aug 2013 at 11:17
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eliotrw

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Post #45
HAha quality buzz

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Posted 25th Aug 2013 at 20:04
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gti6girl

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Post #46
Quality....lol
Posted 25th Aug 2013 at 21:04
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mattgti6phase2

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Post #47
As a few of you know my car is pretty damn low (-60mm) and has been for 3 years and my lemforder drop links sit in a very natural position and are still fine to this day Yes

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Posted 25th Aug 2013 at 22:45
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buzzbrightyear

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Post #48
eliotrw wrote:
HAha quality buzz

A forum freind did it for me!

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Posted 26th Aug 2013 at 00:21
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mark.evs

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Post #49
I had this discussion a few years back with someone. you can get longer links, or you can loosen the ARB at the D bush, Fit your standard links, let the car sit on its own weight, on a ramp or with the front wheels on blocks, then tighten the the D bush. Tried and tested buy myself with no problems at all. The ARB should move on its own in the D bush but i'd fitted new ones and didn't want to put strain on the new bushes or links until at the correct height.

Also never bent a metal link but snapped a few plastic ones on previous 306's, so i always use the metal ones now.

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Posted 26th Aug 2013 at 18:13
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