SC'ed with aftermarket management - Engines Forum - Peugeot 306 GTi-6 & Rallye Owners Club

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Subject: SC'ed with aftermarket management

pete_rallye

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Post #26

tompaltridge wrote:

pete_rallye wrote:

Indeed but I'd love to know who decided the rods are good for 300bhp and what they based their conclusion on...

Was it possibly post #564 in this thread?
http://www.306gti6.com/forum/showthread.php?id=152563&page=23

Specifically:

Takedown wrote:

Fact is why go forged if youre looking for around 350BHP, when the stock engine with a sandwichplate will take this night and day.

Could well be, but even then he says there are numerous 350+hp engines on stock rods (and pistons by all accounts), which would suggest they can take a lot more than 300bhp. Truth is, no one actually knows until someone commits some dosh to turboing or scing a standard engine and see what it makes before it blows up.

Just p**ses me off when people sprout s**t they've heard, or just made up without actually having a clue what they are on about.

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Posted 29th Jul 2013 at 21:01

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vts_tibi

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Post #27

An aftermarket ECU also gives you flexibility. Like my VEMS can store four different ECU maps (in reality I only use two, one for E85 and one for RON95 petrol), and you can set things like ALS, launch control, and they can be used to give data to a digital dash, like AIM.

Only downside from my experience that nobody managed to map my VEMS to make it a comfortable daily driver. When somone maps the ECU there's X °C outside, say 30 on a hot day. To make it perform well in cold I would have to bring the car back when it's wintertime...

This is all done whitin the original ECU, but it's very time consuming and also expensive on a standalone. But if's a racecar who gives a fcuk if it won't want to rev properly after a cold start?

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Posted 29th Jul 2013 at 21:19

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Takedown

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Post #28

The VEMS turbod peugeot ive driven drive and coldstart perfect! you need to take a mappingtrip to DP Engineering and let Pieter work his magic.

THeres no need to have your car mapped again when its wintertime, that utter bulls**t,you need to find someone capable thats all Wink

Posted 29th Jul 2013 at 23:49

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midlife

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Post #29

Takedown wrote:

you need to find someone capable thats all Wink

Here in lies the problem.....

Cool

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Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 00:14

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rallyestyle

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Post #30

midlife wrote:

Takedown wrote:

you need to find someone capable thats all Wink

Here in lies the problem.....

Cool

Please tell me thats not your excuse for not finishing yet?! LOL

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Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 09:02

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midlife

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Post #31

Lol...

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Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 08:59

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marco gti6

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Post #32

stan_306gti6 wrote:

When Rich first developed the low boost setup, it was running about 290bhp, but it was suggested to detune it to around the 260bhp mark for bullet proof reliability. Yes

So Stan how can it be that a sc'd Clio 3 RS with the C30-94 charger "only" gets a plus of 50bhp on stock engine internals while the XU10J4RS apparently gets 120bhp on top of the original bhp (in order to make 290 that is).
This while being a much older and less efficient engine than the one from the clio. Dunno

Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 09:45

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stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

Location: Kent

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Post #33

It's simply down to what size restrictor is used, that's all. You can run what boost levels you like but obviously the engine needs to be reliable and therefore the power was restricted down to a lower level to ensure they didn't blow up.

Also, the Clio is a girl's car so that's why the power is less, lol. Razz

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Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 10:10

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midlife

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Post #34

________________________________________

Get used to seeing the yellow one !!! Meh

Team 330�

Team "no front end or engine"
Team "LIMITED EDITION" I live for the 306 sticker Smug

Team 0-60 in 6.44 & standing qtr in 14.808 @ 94.55mph all with std engine Smug

203bhp Corolla T-Sport daily driver stealthier than Kwai Chang Caine

Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 10:44

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coskev

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Post #35

marco gti6 wrote:

stan_306gti6 wrote:

When Rich first developed the low boost setup, it was running about 290bhp, but it was suggested to detune it to around the 260bhp mark for bullet proof reliability. Yes

Bit of a stupid thing to ask without knowing all the info imo Dunno

Perhaps the Clio engine can't take the amount of boost the XU can,
perhaps the Clio tuners who sell the kit want ultra reliability,
perhaps they have not tried getting more from the clio,

Dunno

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Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 10:56

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marco gti6

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Post #36

Unfortunately this is all the info i could find about it

http://www.k-tecracing.com/news.asp

No information about boost levels except "low boost" but due to it being the exact same charger bolted to a much more recent/efficient engine that makes 30bhp more than the XU10J4RS in standard form i thought it would be worth asking Stan as he definitely knows his stuff when it comes to forced induction on originally NA engines.
BTW i was always told that there is no such thing as stupid questions, only stupid answers..... or something along those lines Thumbs up

Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 11:14

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superchargedblack1997gti6

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Post #37

Simple to work out i think the clio runs at 11:5:1 compression ratio so i would presume they can't run as high boost on it without race fuel!

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Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 11:51

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marco gti6

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Post #38

superchargedblack1997gti6 wrote:

Simple to work out i think the clio runs at 11:5:1 compression ratio so i would presume they can't run as high boost on it without race fuel!

So you reckon they would run less than 0,5 bar of boost on low boost? LB 6's run on 0.7 IIRC... however as soon as it comes to compression ratios i'm out as i have no real understanding what that is about LOL

Cheers anyway Thumbs up

Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 13:08

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phillipm

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Post #39

marco gti6 wrote:

And on an S2000, which is way more efficient than either, the same 'charger will push 370bhp at the same 0.7bar...with 11.7:1 compression.

Apples + oranges.

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Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 13:26

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welshpug!

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Post #40

not just that but of what I have read on the n-a F4R engines seem to hit a wall ar around 220 bhp without spending obscene money on them, where a pug isn't hard to take up over 250-270 without going nuts.

the turbo variant seems a totally different engine, can't imagine why anyone would bother fitting a supercharger when that one is available.

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Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 13:28

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marco gti6

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Post #41

So basically it's all down to compression ratios?? Very impressive figures on the S2000 with the same boost levels Crazy

Cheers for the helpful input guys Thumbs up

Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 13:39

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phillipm

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Post #42

Airflow through the head, dynamic compression, cam specs, chamber design, etc, etc.

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Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 13:43

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welshpug!

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Post #43

many of the Type R engines on cam in effect have a pretty wild rally cam.

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Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 14:55

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phillipm

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Post #44

Knocking on for 300 degrees of duration on the second cam.

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Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 15:19

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pugheaven

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Post #45

Just to add my 2 pence worth, didn't Toms old tubro car bend a standard rod at 300hp? maybe that is where the 300 max hp figure came from?

Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 16:58

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coskev

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Post #46

A turbo will bend a rod at lower bhp than a sc iirc, as the turbo peaks and produces more torque. Wink

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Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 19:12

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superchargedblack1997gti6

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Post #47

If i remember right toms was running an insane amount of boost at that point which would produce massive torque spikes!

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Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 19:16

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stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

Location: Kent

Registered: 18 Jan 2004

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Post #48

Yes, I believe it was around the 300bhp mark when Tom's let go on standard rods. Yes

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Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 19:49

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ash

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Post #49

I ran my c30/94 on Emerald and my c38/81 and c38/91 on it too; it was mapped by the Steve's at Track abd Road and has been great. The c30 ate its air filter and destroyed its shaft and compressor wheel. The c38/81 snapped its shaft as I over spun it too much but I had a new shaft made and have kept it as a spare. I now run the c38/91 and changed the pulley size to keep it within its max speed. I have loads of spares and will list them all for sale when I get round to it...

Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 19:54

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stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

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Post #50

ash wrote:

Do you notice much difference between the C38/81 and C38/91 Ash? Dunno

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Posted 30th Jul 2013 at 21:45

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