displaying posts 51 to 75 of 87

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Author Subject: 1.6 conversion to the 2.0l gti6 running crap
stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

Location: Kent

Registered: 18 Jan 2004

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Post #51
High compression pistons will be better than low compression ones in your case...

However, you need to try and get a set of oversize pistons that are as near as possible to creating standard compression of 10.8:1.

You will achieve something by doing this, but really without serious engine mods both high and low comp pistons are a no no.

Before you tear it apart again, you need to find out for the place you purchased the pistons whether they are high or low comp for definite. There seems to be some confusion spread over the threads on here. Yes

________________________________________

"Supercharged - 454.1bhp/317.5lb/ft"
Peugeot 306 GTi-6
2000 (X), Moonstone Love
Posted 16th Mar 2012 at 07:25
Teshboi1988

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Post #52
cos i guy emailed me saying hes gota turbo but high comp pistons and wants a swap with my low ones?....

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phase 3 Hatchback V reg 5Door GTi6
Posted 16th Mar 2012 at 07:35
Teshboi1988

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Post #53
they are low comp ones. =(

so shal i swap for high comp ones? 87mm i bored it to... and the swap is also 87mm high comp ones...

well i will be doing some serious engine mods in future cams etc bt i need car bk on road asap thats the thing. but i want atleast standard power...

________________________________________

phase 3 Hatchback V reg 5Door GTi6
Posted 16th Mar 2012 at 07:49
Teshboi1988

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Post #54
thanks for ur help stan and others btw =]

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phase 3 Hatchback V reg 5Door GTi6
Posted 16th Mar 2012 at 07:53
anth

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Location: Colchester

Registered: 04 Apr 2006

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Post #55
That would seem your only option if the block has been bored out..

Or put a standard engine in and build the other one up gradually.

Sounds like an epic f**k you up on your part mate.

Personally I'd get another engine it's going to less hassle I can see this getting deeper the way it's going.
Posted 16th Mar 2012 at 20:43
stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

Location: Kent

Registered: 18 Jan 2004

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Post #56
I'm with Anth here, change the engine for a standard one and build this one up slowly ready for charging later down the line. Yes

________________________________________

"Supercharged - 454.1bhp/317.5lb/ft"
Peugeot 306 GTi-6
2000 (X), Moonstone Love
Posted 17th Mar 2012 at 00:45
Teshboi1988

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Post #57
thanks for advice anth and stan..
i no iv fukt up big style
but i think id rather swap pistons to high comp ones....

anth you said they produce more power but chance of pre ignition bt i cn over come that with better cams which il have to do.

iv got my car at my work placement n boss dont mind letting work onit wen we not busy....

________________________________________

phase 3 Hatchback V reg 5Door GTi6
Posted 17th Mar 2012 at 08:29
stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

Location: Kent

Registered: 18 Jan 2004

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Post #58
Teshboi1988 wrote:

iv got my car at my work placement n boss dont mind letting work onit wen we not busy....


That's good because it sounds like you've got a lot of work that needs doing. Smile

________________________________________

"Supercharged - 454.1bhp/317.5lb/ft"
Peugeot 306 GTi-6
2000 (X), Moonstone Love
Posted 17th Mar 2012 at 12:25
Teshboi1988

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Post #59
so can i overcome pre ignition with better cams??

so what i gota do mate?

once iv got pistons in and everything bk together i no i gta get it remapped (does it have to be ona rolling road or can it be done my a guy who just comes out??)

anything else that needs to be done?? asin loads needs needs doing? asin stripping it down? or it there other bits?

________________________________________

phase 3 Hatchback V reg 5Door GTi6
Posted 17th Mar 2012 at 16:30
stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

Location: Kent

Registered: 18 Jan 2004

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Post #60
The mapping will need to be done on a rolling road to get it running right. Yes

You may need to go to a set of cams which have less lift IF the high compression pistons cause them to raise higher up the bores, as there won't be enough valve clearance.

You need to make sure you've got decent compression, enough valve clearance and get it remapped. Weighing up the cost of this though, will probably set you back £400 for mapping, £200 ish for a set of new cams, and whatever deal you're doing with the pistons. This could still all be done and it not run right. The milder cams will not help the reviness of the engine for starters.

Given that a standard engine could be bought for about £350 these days, I still believe personally you are better off just to get another engine and swap them. Yes

________________________________________

"Supercharged - 454.1bhp/317.5lb/ft"
Peugeot 306 GTi-6
2000 (X), Moonstone Love
Posted 17th Mar 2012 at 19:37
anth

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Post #61
stan_306gti6 wrote:


Given that a standard engine could be bought for about £350 these days, I still believe personally you are better off just to get another engine and swap them. Yes


Yes Totally agree it will cost more than you think it always does, cut your losses!
Posted 17th Mar 2012 at 19:48
Teshboi1988

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Post #62
for pistons doing a straight swap wen i get em out bn speaking to a guy on ebay whose selling high comp forged wossner pistons 87mm he wants my low ones aslong as they nt damaged.

what cams you recommend?
so i gota check compression what should i be getting in compression psi/bar...
how wood i check if i got enough clearance? iv had head skimmed and valves cut n seated
i gta budget of bout 1500

________________________________________

phase 3 Hatchback V reg 5Door GTi6
Posted 18th Mar 2012 at 08:09
buzzbrightyear

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Post #63
Compression test on a standard engine is about 200-220 I think.
Somebody will be along to correct me tho

________________________________________

andrew315rawson@live.co.uk
Moonstone phase 7 gti6
My Project thread: http://www.306gti6.com/forum/showthread.php?id=119992&page=1
Posted 18th Mar 2012 at 10:43
stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

Location: Kent

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Post #64
buzzbrightyear wrote:
Compression test on a standard engine is about 200-220 I think.
Somebody will be along to correct me tho


This is correct. Wink

However, with a budget of £1500, spend £350 on a replacement engine and keep the £1150 for other mods like brakes/suspension/tyres. Yes

________________________________________

"Supercharged - 454.1bhp/317.5lb/ft"
Peugeot 306 GTi-6
2000 (X), Moonstone Love
Posted 18th Mar 2012 at 12:34
Teshboi1988

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Post #65
yea got sports gti suspension already on front and rear...

drilled and grooved disks front and rear...

and got 4 marshall tyres...

straight through exhaust stainless steel system

all i got to do is engine now...

________________________________________

phase 3 Hatchback V reg 5Door GTi6
Posted 19th Mar 2012 at 07:11
Teshboi1988

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Post #66
so i got be looking for compression more than 220psi...

________________________________________

phase 3 Hatchback V reg 5Door GTi6
Posted 19th Mar 2012 at 07:12
swiftyboi006

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Post #67
No Between 200-220 and they all need to be within this.... I dont get where your going with this? I dont think you have thought about it enough

________________________________________

cherry p1.....SOLD (regreting this)
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Black p3 Love
Posted 19th Mar 2012 at 07:35
Teshboi1988

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Post #68
oo i wood have thought id need more compression...

wel by putting bigger pistons in which raise compression woodnt i be getting more power and less fuel consumption??

________________________________________

phase 3 Hatchback V reg 5Door GTi6
Posted 19th Mar 2012 at 08:22
stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

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Post #69
To a degree you are correct, however a higher compression ratio will lead to pre-ignition if not controlled.

________________________________________

"Supercharged - 454.1bhp/317.5lb/ft"
Peugeot 306 GTi-6
2000 (X), Moonstone Love
Posted 19th Mar 2012 at 08:25
Teshboi1988

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Post #70
how can i control it?? and how much compression should i be looking for isit between 200-220 or more if so how much more

thanks

________________________________________

phase 3 Hatchback V reg 5Door GTi6
Posted 19th Mar 2012 at 08:33
stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

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Post #71
Around the 200 - 210psi is what you should be looking for ideally. Yes

It can be controlled with mapping to a point. What is it thats stopping you buying another engine? If you go down the route of changing the pistons you will removing your current engine anyway, so why not just replace it with a standard lump? At least then you know it will fire straight up and run correctly. Plus the price will be set at the price of the engine, whereas who knows how much the current lump is going to cost you in the end to get it running right if you ever manage to achieve that...

________________________________________

"Supercharged - 454.1bhp/317.5lb/ft"
Peugeot 306 GTi-6
2000 (X), Moonstone Love
Posted 19th Mar 2012 at 08:46
mcfc1987

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Post #72
Where is the banging head against a brick wall smiley.

As said above, unfortunately mate you have made a massive error and need to cut your losses, it's going to cost close to a grand to change out the pistons (again) change the cams, get it mapped properly and it still might not run right. a replacement engine will cost you about £300 and if you can fit it yourslef it's a no brainer. get the car running and if you really want more power do it properly

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Posted 19th Mar 2012 at 09:03
daveyboy

aka Jim Davey

Location: Southampton

Registered: 01 Oct 2007

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Post #73
If I were you, I'd do what I did and buy and read a few books on engine building, if that sounds like too much trouble pick up a copy of the Burton Power catogue, its got lots of useful engine builder info and calcs for working out compression ratios. Before you make another expensive mistake with your engine, familiarise yourself with a few of the basic principles behind how naturally aspirated and forced induction lumps work and that will help you understand what is being suggested to you.

You need to decide which route to go down, sounds to me like your cheapest route is naturally aspirated. For this to work you will want the high comp pistons and some hotter cams, check the cam manufacturers lift figures carefully, you will need to make sure that your cams will be compatible with your intended piston. (The only way to know this is with a dummy build, the details of which will be covered in even the most basic engine builders manual) go for something high lift and long duration, forget cams designed for standard pistons (PT81's etc) you are buying race pistons so fit rally cams, these will give you some driveability whilst making the most of your new, higher CR (compression ratio) You should consider a look at the induction, throttle bodies are a popular choice. If the budget will stretch to it think about upgrading the ECU to something mappable, this will save you money in the long run if you intend to upgrade the engine over time as tweaks can be made without requiring a total remap.

If you can do the swap then the pistons will cost you nothing HOWEVER, check the wrist pin is the same size, as far as I know low comp Wössners use a 22mm pin the high comps use a 20mm one.

The cams will set you back 2-400 depending on what/where you buy. You will need an updated head gasket and a skim if you haven't had one, budget 200 for that. Mapping is going to be 2-400 depending on wether you have a mappable ECU or standard, standard means a trip to Chip Wizzards and £400. I don't recall you mentioning rods, but if you stay with standard ones you will handicap the rest if the build as you will have to restrict yourself to 7,500 rpm, this could rob you of potentially 10-15 extra horses if you can take it to 8,000 rpm on some forged rods then you really should do it. Budget £500ish for PEC Nd £900 for Saenz.

If this is starting to sound a little expensive, tough, building a reliable and powerful engine requires all of the main components to work as a whole, you can't just insert one extreme race part and expect it to coexist with standard bits and still work. I would guess you are a third of the way there with your bearings, sundries, pistons (if they are compatible) and your machining. If you need a car on the road fast, chuck in a used engine to get you going, then save for the other bits needed to do a proper job of it.

Stick with it and you will have a stonking engine, rush into a half arsed job though and at best you will has an expensive engine that struggles to exceed standard power or at worst completely destroys itself within a few hundred miles.

The choice is yours.

________________________________________

R H Davey Welding Supplies. I sell new and used welding equipment in the Hampshire area. I take on welding jobs in the evenings, ally casting repairs are one of my specialities but I can weld pretty much anything. PM me with your requirements.

Some of my services: (See my for sale threads)
Engine mount/chassis repair
Solid Beam Mounts BACK IN PRODUCTION
Harness bars
Posted 19th Mar 2012 at 19:34
stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

Location: Kent

Registered: 18 Jan 2004

Posts: 21,768

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Post #74
A good, well put, informative post there ^^......Yes

________________________________________

"Supercharged - 454.1bhp/317.5lb/ft"
Peugeot 306 GTi-6
2000 (X), Moonstone Love
Posted 19th Mar 2012 at 21:53
Teshboi1988

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Location: Dartford

Registered: 29 Jan 2012

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Post #75
ok right brilliant... well hada a good think and decided to just a get a block with standard pistons.. ad il get new rings for the minute just wanna get it on the road. then next year il do some more mods.

any1 on here sell me a 98 block with pistons??

________________________________________

phase 3 Hatchback V reg 5Door GTi6
Posted 20th Mar 2012 at 07:29

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