displaying posts 26 to 50 of 62

Pages (3): 1 [2] 3

Author Subject: heat wrap
fatlapit

Seasoned Pro

Location: STOCKSFIELD

Registered: 02 Nov 2010

Posts: 3,040

Status: Offline

Post #26
stan_306gti6 wrote:
fatlapit wrote:
Worth every penny u get wat u pay for. imo bearing in mind this is for proper motorsport and it is one of the best ways of keeping the exhaust cool.


How are you keeping the exhaust cool? By wrapping it you are insulating it meaning that it will stay hotter. Also, if you wrap a manifold, then the downpipe will get hotter as a result due to the gases passing through the manifold are not releasing heat to the outside.

In my humble opinion, I don't believe exhaust wrap is a good idea. No


ceramic coating mate, ex mani, turbine housing and the downpipe, also gonna put gold heat reflection on the bulkhead and paybe some vents on the bonnet to keep the under bonnet temp down. It will be very expensive i know but well worth the cash and when you think it will never fail and it cant rot the exhaust system, plus it looks cool as fcuk.Big grin

________________________________________


Posted 16th Apr 2012 at 17:20
fatlapit

Seasoned Pro

Location: STOCKSFIELD

Registered: 02 Nov 2010

Posts: 3,040

Status: Offline

Post #27
Q31. What temperature reduction can I expect with my coated exhaust.... - Our Performance RangeTM offers typical surface temperature reductions of 33%; so if your uncoated exhaust operates at say 600oC , then our ceramic coating will reduce this to just 400oC (so a massive 200oC reduction). This has a major impact on the amount of heat escaping into the engine compartment, and on the temperature of components close to the exhaust. Our ceramic coating has in fact been demonstrated to reduce general underbonnet temperatures by up to 50oC (122oF).

http://www.zircotec.com/page/frequent_questions/5

________________________________________


Posted 16th Apr 2012 at 17:22
jimmyhackers

Seasoned Pro

Location: birmingham

Registered: 14 Jun 2011

Posts: 1,144

Status: Offline

Post #28
id honestly say wrapping your exhaust is pointless. The only reason is to prevent heat soak into your engine bay. And seeing as the heat sheilding there is already sufficient i wouldnt bother. Theres a lot of..........psudo science around heat flow and how hot gasses flow better. This may be the case of sorts, basically all the equations ive seen dont really take into account the expansion an contraction of gasses with heat and factor it into the flow rate. If a mooving hot gas is cooling through the pipe. Its contracting which effects flow rate.......however exactly the same amount of gas is mooving through the pipe regardless of hot its staying

________________________________________

the world is changed by people in sheds
Posted 16th Apr 2012 at 20:33
stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

Location: Kent

Registered: 18 Jan 2004

Posts: 21,768

Status: Offline

Post #29
Why do F1 engineers and Moto GP engineers not heat wrap their exhausts/manifolds?

Is it against the regulations? Dunno

If it's not against the regulations, then I guess they would be doing it if they felt it to be of benefit?

________________________________________

"Supercharged - 454.1bhp/317.5lb/ft"
Peugeot 306 GTi-6
2000 (X), Moonstone Love
Posted 16th Apr 2012 at 20:36
fatlapit

Seasoned Pro

Location: STOCKSFIELD

Registered: 02 Nov 2010

Posts: 3,040

Status: Offline

Post #30
no its just crap lol

________________________________________


Posted 16th Apr 2012 at 20:46
bigbadbowen

Seasoned Pro

Location: Winchester

Registered: 21 Nov 2003

Posts: 13,753

Status: Offline

Post #31
They use other coatings not heat wrap
Thumbs up
Posted 16th Apr 2012 at 20:49
stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

Location: Kent

Registered: 18 Jan 2004

Posts: 21,768

Status: Offline

Post #32
bigbadbowen wrote:
They use other coatings not heat wrap
Thumbs up


Fair enough. Although I suppose they are not worried if they burn valves out after 20k miles as the engines only do about a 1000 each before rebuild. Wink

Whether the long-term effects would be detrimental to our engines after thousands of miles I don't know, but I have read many an article stating that keeping heat in manifolds is not good for cylinder head components. Yes

________________________________________

"Supercharged - 454.1bhp/317.5lb/ft"
Peugeot 306 GTi-6
2000 (X), Moonstone Love
Posted 16th Apr 2012 at 22:25
daveyboy

aka Jim Davey

Location: Southampton

Registered: 01 Oct 2007

Posts: 8,648

Status: Offline

Post #33
I makes me laugh when you start comparing what works on top level race cars to souped up shopping trolleys! F1 exhaust systems are Inconel and can handle ridiculously high exhaust temps, due to packaging constraints (proximity of very close fitting bodywork etc) they may well use ceramic or similar coatings to try and keep the heat in.
As for heat wrap, yes it's more likely to cause head warpage as often the heat will be trapped in the manifold for longer (especially with a convoluted system like ours come with as standard) but that needs to be weighed up against the detrimental effects of increased under bonnet temps (Detonation, failed electrical components, heat soak on coolers, radiators etc).
If you start doing things to your car that optimise performance in one area you are likely to reduce its lifespan or performance in another area. If you heat wrap on a road car you should expect reduced life of the manifold due to the increased heat and corrosion from trapped damp, and unless you allow a cool down period at the end of hard drives you risk warping the head. (less likely if your water/oil cooling system is well suited to the kind of abuse the car will be subjected to)

________________________________________

R H Davey Welding Supplies. I sell new and used welding equipment in the Hampshire area. I take on welding jobs in the evenings, ally casting repairs are one of my specialities but I can weld pretty much anything. PM me with your requirements.

Some of my services: (See my for sale threads)
Engine mount/chassis repair
Solid Beam Mounts BACK IN PRODUCTION
Harness bars
Posted 17th Apr 2012 at 14:29
fatlapit

Seasoned Pro

Location: STOCKSFIELD

Registered: 02 Nov 2010

Posts: 3,040

Status: Offline

Post #34
both ceramics and heat wrap are used on road cars, its all about budget really, just another mod to consider.

________________________________________


Posted 17th Apr 2012 at 21:19
beez_neez_gt

Seasoned Pro

Location: @ de limit of adhesion !

Registered: 14 Oct 2008

Posts: 2,916

Status: Offline

Post #35
stan_306gti6 wrote:
bigbadbowen wrote:
They use other coatings not heat wrap
Thumbs up


Fair enough. Although I suppose they are not worried if they burn valves out after 20k miles as the engines only do about a 1000 each before rebuild. Wink

Whether the long-term effects would be detrimental to our engines after thousands of miles I don't know, but I have read many an article stating that keeping heat in manifolds is not good for cylinder head components. Yes


Isn't the whole point in using manifold coatings because the extra heat makes the exhaust gases escape more quickly and efficiently, thus reducing exhaust gas blow back ?

________________________________________

Pug fee`ver,

Pick a Bogey, buy a Pug.

Black 306 GTI 6 Standard, was 60k mileage, bargain!!

Clicky: [url =http://www.306gti6.com]click here[/url] remove the space between [url & =
Posted 18th Apr 2012 at 19:07
jimmyhackers

Seasoned Pro

Location: birmingham

Registered: 14 Jun 2011

Posts: 1,144

Status: Offline

Post #36
the hot gasses flow better than cold ones.....is for all intents a myth. The expansion and contraction of the gas due to heatflow is not envoved in the equation. Very convienent when the companies who sell this s**t to people as a "performance upgrade" fail to leave this out. I.e as the gas cools through the pipe the gas shrinks, reducing flow. However the exact same amount of gas is getting through in the exact same amount of time. the only reason you would wrap/coat any part of your exhaust is if you think its gonna set fire to something or start melting other parts. YOU WILL NOT GAIN BHP THIS IS NOT A TRUE PERFORMANCE MOD BY ITSELF

________________________________________

the world is changed by people in sheds
Posted 18th Apr 2012 at 20:14
beez_neez_gt

Seasoned Pro

Location: @ de limit of adhesion !

Registered: 14 Oct 2008

Posts: 2,916

Status: Offline

Post #37
Hot engine's dont 'perform' as well as the cooler ones.

Why would companies such as Aston Martin use cam coat ?

You dont get any more bhp from using a light fly or engine pulley yet there is still some noticeable performance from using those uprated parts.

I wouldn't use any heat wrap, but if i could i'd get the manifold coated then i would, they have tested the coatings with salt spray experiments etc.

________________________________________

Pug fee`ver,

Pick a Bogey, buy a Pug.

Black 306 GTI 6 Standard, was 60k mileage, bargain!!

Clicky: [url =http://www.306gti6.com]click here[/url] remove the space between [url & =
Posted 19th Apr 2012 at 00:34
daveyboy

aka Jim Davey

Location: Southampton

Registered: 01 Oct 2007

Posts: 8,648

Status: Offline

Post #38
beez_neez_gt wrote:
Hot engine's dont 'perform' as well as the cooler ones.

Why would companies such as Aston Martin use cam coat ?

You dont get any more bhp from using a light fly or engine pulley yet there is still some noticeable performance from using those uprated parts.

I wouldn't use any heat wrap, but if i could i'd get the manifold coated then i would, they have tested the coatings with salt spray experiments etc.


When you cram a V12 into an engine bay heat management becomes a real concern, I suspect that's the only reason they ceramic coated it was to stop it melting wires, soundproofing and anything else in close proximity to the exhaust headers.
There are additional. Benefits as you mentioned such as increased service life due to lack of corrosion but I expect controlling engine bay temps was one of their primary concerns.

________________________________________

R H Davey Welding Supplies. I sell new and used welding equipment in the Hampshire area. I take on welding jobs in the evenings, ally casting repairs are one of my specialities but I can weld pretty much anything. PM me with your requirements.

Some of my services: (See my for sale threads)
Engine mount/chassis repair
Solid Beam Mounts BACK IN PRODUCTION
Harness bars
Posted 19th Apr 2012 at 07:51
jimmyhackers

Seasoned Pro

Location: birmingham

Registered: 14 Jun 2011

Posts: 1,144

Status: Offline

Post #39
i didnt think exactly in the way of corrosional effects, my 17 year old phase one gti for all intents still had its original exhaust manifold and it was/still is in pretty good nick, internally and externally. (even after bouncing 50 feet from my car attached to the engine)

i half imagine it could double that figure and still be in as functional condition.

heat wrapping or even a cermaic coating could cause internal 'skaling' or oxidization of the pipe to a larger extent due to the intense heat being trapped inside. however from the outisde the coating would keep up the appearance of alls well and will stop external oxidization. more so ceramic as it seals the outside layer airtight and would add a regidity to the pipe unlike wraps.

these scales... can flake off weakening the metal structure. pitting the internal surface making for uneven/interupted flow. these could block baffles etc reducing silencer lifespan and performance.

________________________________________

the world is changed by people in sheds
Posted 20th Apr 2012 at 23:51
fatlapit

Seasoned Pro

Location: STOCKSFIELD

Registered: 02 Nov 2010

Posts: 3,040

Status: Offline

Post #40
there is an ingredient in heat wrap that promotes the rusting and degredation of the metal of the manifold. the only gains of heat management is cooler under bonnet temps that is all

________________________________________


Posted 21st Apr 2012 at 15:29
dragoon

Seasoned Pro

Location: Ghent - Belgium

Registered: 30 Dec 2008

Posts: 1,071

Status: Offline

Post #41
stop scaring me :'(

________________________________________

Team Wheelwhore
Team Limited Edition

Astor 306 Francorchamps RIP
Virtual Blue 208 GTi

quote:
I Love this place. So many illiterate deluded fool's acting 'ard . . . and so many literate intelligent people to rip them apart and knock them back down again . . . ahh Cool
Posted 22nd Apr 2012 at 15:27
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

Registered: 27 Mar 2007

Posts: 25,838

Status: Offline

Post #42
should have just fitted that missing heatshield Razz

has everyone forgotten that the original manifold is stainless steel?

________________________________________

need a part number? get on here - http://public.servicebox.peugeot.com

Bring on the Trumpets.

Posted 22nd Apr 2012 at 15:46
beez_neez_gt

Seasoned Pro

Location: @ de limit of adhesion !

Registered: 14 Oct 2008

Posts: 2,916

Status: Offline

Post #43
The 6 manifold ?

________________________________________

Pug fee`ver,

Pick a Bogey, buy a Pug.

Black 306 GTI 6 Standard, was 60k mileage, bargain!!

Clicky: [url =http://www.306gti6.com]click here[/url] remove the space between [url & =
Posted 22nd Apr 2012 at 15:54
eliotrw

Seasoned Pro

Location: Southwark

Registered: 18 Jul 2010

Posts: 4,864

Status: Offline

Post #44
Is it? How come they always look like rusty arse? Heat?

________________________________________

Ex- Phase 3 China GTi-6 T-Reg
Posted 22nd Apr 2012 at 15:54
beez_neez_gt

Seasoned Pro

Location: @ de limit of adhesion !

Registered: 14 Oct 2008

Posts: 2,916

Status: Offline

Post #45
Yeah mine was rusty, once sandblasted it looked very clean steel.

________________________________________

Pug fee`ver,

Pick a Bogey, buy a Pug.

Black 306 GTI 6 Standard, was 60k mileage, bargain!!

Clicky: [url =http://www.306gti6.com]click here[/url] remove the space between [url & =
Posted 22nd Apr 2012 at 15:58
fatlapit

Seasoned Pro

Location: STOCKSFIELD

Registered: 02 Nov 2010

Posts: 3,040

Status: Offline

Post #46
All stainless manifold will end up looking like crap due to theat

________________________________________


Posted 22nd Apr 2012 at 15:58
beez_neez_gt

Seasoned Pro

Location: @ de limit of adhesion !

Registered: 14 Oct 2008

Posts: 2,916

Status: Offline

Post #47
Must be a rubbish grade of stainless then, the head joining part was very rusty enough to flake off, the pipes just looked the colour of rust.

________________________________________

Pug fee`ver,

Pick a Bogey, buy a Pug.

Black 306 GTI 6 Standard, was 60k mileage, bargain!!

Clicky: [url =http://www.306gti6.com]click here[/url] remove the space between [url & =
Posted 22nd Apr 2012 at 16:00
fatlapit

Seasoned Pro

Location: STOCKSFIELD

Registered: 02 Nov 2010

Posts: 3,040

Status: Offline

Post #48
Titanium ftw

________________________________________


Posted 22nd Apr 2012 at 16:08
stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

Location: Kent

Registered: 18 Jan 2004

Posts: 21,768

Status: Offline

Post #49
I didn't know the standard '6' manifold was stainless. Is this definitely correct?

________________________________________

"Supercharged - 454.1bhp/317.5lb/ft"
Peugeot 306 GTi-6
2000 (X), Moonstone Love
Posted 22nd Apr 2012 at 17:27
beez_neez_gt

Seasoned Pro

Location: @ de limit of adhesion !

Registered: 14 Oct 2008

Posts: 2,916

Status: Offline

Post #50
If it was then is must have been a low grade stainless, the magnet doesn't stick to it very well though.

________________________________________

Pug fee`ver,

Pick a Bogey, buy a Pug.

Black 306 GTI 6 Standard, was 60k mileage, bargain!!

Clicky: [url =http://www.306gti6.com]click here[/url] remove the space between [url & =
Posted 22nd Apr 2012 at 19:13

Pages (3): 1 [2] 3

All times are GMT. The time is now 00:22

The Peugeot GTi-6 & Rallye Owners Club - ©2024 all rights reserved.

Please Note: The views and opinions found herein are those of individuals, and not of The Peugeot 306 GTi-6 & Rallye Owners Club or any individuals involved.
No responsibility is taken or assumed for any comments or statements made on, or in relation to, this website. Please see our updated privacy policy.