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Author Subject: Project Induction kit
monkeyman

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Post #1
A car tuner I know makes bespoke induction kits, mainly for smaller engined Pugs, Citroens and Fiats, but has had a look at making one for my 306. His main objective is to increase mid range torque and driveability, rather than just bhp. The 306 has little room for fitting one, but we manged to put it behind the passenger fog light, though it meant removing one of the horns and fog light, and moving the alarm box.


shows the path from the throttle. This is a design version, the final one will be a single piece with no jubilee clips. Also the idle feed will come from the top pipe.


front foglight removed for cold air, I'll have to take the other one off for the MOT I think.

It sounds great
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RbVHGZLq7c

(My other mods are a PTFE induction gasket, induction resonator cap, straight through mid exhaust section, standard rear box and Denso Irridium spark plugs.)

The designer would like to know if there is much interest in these kits. Kits for other cars are around the

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Posted 6th Apr 2010 at 02:01
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benn25

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Post #2
Is that an eco valve behind that breather?
Posted 14th Oct 2009 at 23:28
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Lecktorious

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Post #3
GSR per chance?

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Posted 16th Oct 2009 at 04:05
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adam b

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Post #4
Do you have a pre-kit graph as well, don't want to seem cynical but I don't trust dyno figures Smile

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Posted 16th Oct 2009 at 04:30
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lwgti-6

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Post #5
Would be interesting to see them cheaper than the

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Posted 16th Oct 2009 at 04:45
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mpaul

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Post #6
Yeah, the GSR kits come in for a lot of criticism, as often the RR test is done after other mods are fitted at the same time/ or there is no pre induction kit dyno done, so impossible to tell the true gains, and I think he normally does a remap too, so the gains may just be from that anyway, as any car will normally gain a bit from a basic remap.

They may sound good, but I seriously doubt they offer the performance claimed, and cant be too dissimilar to other IKs.

The only way to tell for definate, would be an independant Dyno, then off to GSR, then back to the inde[endant dyno, to see the difference.

All IMO of course.
Posted 16th Oct 2009 at 13:13
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oecken

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Post #7
cant vipers fit in fine? he says after looking at his in pretty much the same place (Dunno)

but pre-mod graph would have been helpful LOL

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Posted 16th Oct 2009 at 13:14
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welshpug!

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Post #8
I want to put my car on that dyno Laugh my ass off

funny how the power seems to go flat at 6k and dips to 7400 odd.



Pre-addon run would make sense, otherwise they're just shooting themselves in the foot by not proving they work as people always take figures like this with serious scepticism.

Try torque of the devil, they're not far and are spot on Thumbs up


quote:
His main objective is to increase mid range torque and driveability, rather than just bhp.


LOL when is this place going to realise that they're never going to do that with a 6 foot long piece of silicone hose and a halfords filter on the end of it...

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Posted 16th Oct 2009 at 14:36
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monkeyman

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Post #9
I had a hectic day yesterday, sorry for not getting back sooner.

I started this in the project forum, as I'm not sure where it will go, it's certainly not a finished product yet, but I hope this thread shows some of the work involved. I'd also appreciate feedback on the ideas that come up.

The shape of the pipework is important. The model I've got fitted is just a mock up to see what could be achieved in the space available, there will hopefully be another design that doesn't involve moving stuff around, but if it doesn't do much for performance, it wont be pursued.

quote:
Is that an eco valve behind that breather?
Yeah, I bought it for my 106 1.3 8v Happy where it did even out a couple of flat spots, but it doesn't really do anything on the 306. I'll remove it for future tests in case it is doing anything small.



sorry pressed submit by mistake, still answering / editing post

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Posted 16th Oct 2009 at 16:47
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monkeyman

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Post #10
quote:
GSR per chance?


I'm working with Peter from GSR, there is a link to his website on the youtube vid.

quote:
Do you have a pre-kit graph as well, don't want to seem cynical but I don't trust dyno figures

This is a work in progress, the first graph was the just an initial run to get an idea of changes. I plan to do runs with the standard filter and standard exhaust for comparison. I've also mentioned the other mods, but the gasket, plugs and induction bung are a bit of a pain to swap about, maybe there is some magic synergy but the standard runs should show anything.

quote:
Would be interesting to see them cheaper than the

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Posted 16th Oct 2009 at 17:34
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phillipm

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Post #11
I would be having a check done before and after on an independent rolling road myself...

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Posted 16th Oct 2009 at 18:56
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adam b

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Post #12
phillipm wrote:
I would be having a check done before and after on an independent rolling road myself...


I would be staying standard with a panel and advancing the cam timing myself. Will keep an eye on this thread though to see what happens.Smile

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Posted 18th Oct 2009 at 04:23
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monkeyman

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Post #13
An independant test can certainly be done when the unit is complete. For the time being development will be done at Red Dot as it is easy to get to.

I think Torque of the Devil in Uxbridge is a well regarded centre, or if you can recommend another one near London.

Regarding cams, I'd love to do some work on timing, but I've not been able to find out much about what other people have done safely in terms of specific degree changes on a standard head setup. If you have any info or pointers I'm keen to find out more.

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Posted 19th Oct 2009 at 20:45
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clen666

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Post #14
monkeyman wrote:

Regarding cams, I'd love to do some work on timing, but I've not been able to find out much about what other people have done safely in terms of specific degree changes on a standard head setup. If you have any info or pointers I'm keen to find out more.

+1

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Posted 19th Oct 2009 at 21:54
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adam b

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Post #15
I'll get Meirion/Welshpug to have a look at mine when he is next over as i've no idea what was actually done.

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Posted 20th Oct 2009 at 18:35
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clen666

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Post #16
nice one Thumbs up

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Posted 21st Oct 2009 at 00:24
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monkeyman

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Post #17
We had a few nice dry days this week, so I tried out another placement





I wouldn't have done this in the wet, as the fliter is in the splash area of the front tyre.

Performance felt generally worse allround, though the noise was louder.

While the bumper area was clear I manged to get the alarm siren refitted, but a new bracket will make it easier.

It looks like the original routing is the best placement performance wise, but does mean saving the weight of the fog lights. Is this a big problem?

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Posted 31st Oct 2009 at 16:43
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jaydog81

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Post #18
I could'nt think of anything worse dude!

Youre not going to see any performance from a filter anyway. Maybe 2-3 bhp which i could sneeze out of my left nostril!

I'd like to see it mounted at the top of the windscreen like a land rover snorkle. but i dont want to give you any more crazy ideasThumbs down

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Posted 4th Nov 2009 at 00:12
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phillipm

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Post #19
You'll knock that straight off on a centre-speedbump...

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Posted 4th Nov 2009 at 01:23
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astragsi237

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Post #20
jaydog81 wrote:
I could'nt think of anything worse dude!

Youre not going to see any performance from a filter anyway. Maybe 2-3 bhp which i could sneeze out of my left nostril!

I'd like to see it mounted at the top of the windscreen like a land rover snorkle. but i dont want to give you any more crazy ideasThumbs down


Surely the lower down the filter is the denser the air is resulting in a bigger bang?? Dunno Or am I just talking out of my arse??

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Posted 4th Nov 2009 at 03:31
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allesclar

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Post #21
astragsi237 wrote:
jaydog81 wrote:
I could'nt think of anything worse dude!

Youre not going to see any performance from a filter anyway. Maybe 2-3 bhp which i could sneeze out of my left nostril!

I'd like to see it mounted at the top of the windscreen like a land rover snorkle. but i dont want to give you any more crazy ideasThumbs down


Surely the lower down the filter is the denser the air is resulting in a bigger bang?? Dunno Or am I just talking out of my arse??


yes but come on, the difference is in the micro amounts, nothing you can measure really. Its all to do with forcing the air in, not how low you get.

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Posted 4th Nov 2009 at 03:39
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astragsi237

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Post #22
allesclar wrote:
astragsi237 wrote:
jaydog81 wrote:
I could'nt think of anything worse dude!

Youre not going to see any performance from a filter anyway. Maybe 2-3 bhp which i could sneeze out of my left nostril!

I'd like to see it mounted at the top of the windscreen like a land rover snorkle. but i dont want to give you any more crazy ideasThumbs down


Surely the lower down the filter is the denser the air is resulting in a bigger bang?? Dunno Or am I just talking out of my arse??


yes but come on, the difference is in the micro amounts, nothing you can measure really. Its all to do with forcing the air in, not how low you get.


Okay Doke Blush

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Posted 4th Nov 2009 at 03:41
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allesclar

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Post #23
its ok Smile but at the end of the day, you can only expect so much from the induction kit. The performance gains even if you maximise everything are still only small compared to a set of better tires or getting the suspension sorted Smile

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Posted 4th Nov 2009 at 03:43
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astragsi237

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Post #24
Very true,which is why I wont bother touching the standard air intake design-Its just not worth the money on a N/A car,Time to splash out on some toyo R888's instead Whistle

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Posted 4th Nov 2009 at 03:57
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jaydog81

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Post #25
Thumbs up Thats a mod you will benifit from.

Twisties:smile

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*jay81.
Phase 2.5/S-99
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Posted 4th Nov 2009 at 12:50
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