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Author Subject: 240bhp
daveyboy

aka Jim Davey

Location: Southampton

Registered: 01 Oct 2007

Posts: 8,648

Status: Offline
Post #51
welshpug! wrote:
I was alluding to a proper inlet rather than an off the shelf point the trumpets at the bonnet item LOL

but that is more cash !


Ouch! Guy Croft was very complimentry of the Longmans/Jenvey inlet manifold. When he flow tested the head with and without it he noticed a marked increase in flow. He went on to say this is very rare as most bench tests he conducts with a bare head flow better than ones with an inlet fitted. (Obviously he radiused the port with some plasticine for his tests, not just a square edge) Is there some hard data to prove that Colin Satchell's inlet is actually better? I don't doubt you for a minute, I just can't see it bieng hugely different as they both have to have a similar bend radius in them for the bodies to fit under the bonnet.

________________________________________

R H Davey Welding Supplies. I sell new and used welding equipment in the Hampshire area. I take on welding jobs in the evenings, ally casting repairs are one of my specialities but I can weld pretty much anything. PM me with your requirements.

Some of my services: (See my for sale threads)
Engine mount/chassis repair
Solid Beam Mounts BACK IN PRODUCTION
Harness bars
Posted 1st Jun 2010 at 15:37
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welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

Registered: 27 Mar 2007

Posts: 25,838

Status: Offline
Post #52
it might on its own flow quite well and I don't doubt Guy's figures one bit

but this is not about flow directly at all, its about the pulse tuning regarding the cam timing, throttle body port diameter, trumpet length etc.

the point regarding the off the shelf manifold, yes the initial radius may be the same as Colins design, but that doesn't mean the bodies will be at the right angle to get a decent length tract if the inlet is too short, you'd need a sharper radius with that length manifold to achieve a decent length overall.

surely a fabricator of your skills could knock something up though?

obviously this is purely based on observations and experience of other peoples work, not my own, I wish it was! and also a brief chat with Colin about them.

as for the hard data, I don't know if there are any direct comparisons on an XU, only that Sandy and Colin's approach gives quite a lot more usable torque bands, I think Sandy has a comparison an a TU engine build from Jenvey to sandy/colin inlet.

I would ask Sandy if there he has any hard figures he'd be willing to part with, as ever its about looking at the whole package rather than a single item or pair of items in isolation.

________________________________________

need a part number? get on here - http://public.servicebox.peugeot.com

Bring on the Trumpets.

Posted 1st Jun 2010 at 16:23
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309btcc

**DODGY SELLER**

Location: england

Registered: 07 Jul 2009

Posts: 530

Status: Offline
Post #53
the guy who baught liams engine had it mapd and set up himsel ollie and it didnt make the 270bhp that colin said it would.thats why nick cant get out of the 13s after spending a fortune when pug1off are doing 12.9s in a 205 with a real 270bhp
Posted 1st Jun 2010 at 18:43
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gtomi-6

Seasoned Pro

Location: southampton

Registered: 16 Jan 2009

Posts: 1,136

Status: Offline
Post #54
im sure all will be sorted at usc this year. i was told that matt jobling designs and profiles his own cams which could be what the differnce is. but it all comes down to driver tyres etc. nicks car is dyno proven 264bhp i belive

________________________________________

ph3 gti-6 china blue- mint condition
ph2 gti-6 nile blue K.I.A dec 2010
Posted 1st Jun 2010 at 22:53
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309btcc

**DODGY SELLER**

Location: england

Registered: 07 Jul 2009

Posts: 530

Status: Offline
Post #55
we shall see what happins as i know he has built a 280bhp engine for a 205 for usc so that should be a animal..
Posted 1st Jun 2010 at 23:16
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gtomi-6

Seasoned Pro

Location: southampton

Registered: 16 Jan 2009

Posts: 1,136

Status: Offline
Post #56
yer id say so mate

________________________________________

ph3 gti-6 china blue- mint condition
ph2 gti-6 nile blue K.I.A dec 2010
Posted 1st Jun 2010 at 23:20
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309btcc

**DODGY SELLER**

Location: england

Registered: 07 Jul 2009

Posts: 530

Status: Offline
Post #57
cant wait too see it m8. iam gettin another blaze 6 the weekend hopefully...maybe if liams engine was set up by richard himself it may have made mre power plus it did only have mild cams now if i remember 11mm lift
Posted 1st Jun 2010 at 23:25
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daveyboy

aka Jim Davey

Location: Southampton

Registered: 01 Oct 2007

Posts: 8,648

Status: Offline
Post #58
309btcc wrote:
cant wait too see it m8. iam gettin another blaze 6 the weekend hopefully...maybe if liams engine was set up by richard himself it may have made mre power plus it did only have mild cams now if i remember 11mm lift


BTCC regs meant standard lift only, but duration was unlimited.

________________________________________

R H Davey Welding Supplies. I sell new and used welding equipment in the Hampshire area. I take on welding jobs in the evenings, ally casting repairs are one of my specialities but I can weld pretty much anything. PM me with your requirements.

Some of my services: (See my for sale threads)
Engine mount/chassis repair
Solid Beam Mounts BACK IN PRODUCTION
Harness bars
Posted 1st Jun 2010 at 23:27
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309btcc

**DODGY SELLER**

Location: england

Registered: 07 Jul 2009

Posts: 530

Status: Offline
Post #59
yeah we all knew that i think
Posted 1st Jun 2010 at 23:28
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daveyboy

aka Jim Davey

Location: Southampton

Registered: 01 Oct 2007

Posts: 8,648

Status: Offline
Post #60
309btcc wrote:
yeah we all knew that i think


What size bodies was it on?

________________________________________

R H Davey Welding Supplies. I sell new and used welding equipment in the Hampshire area. I take on welding jobs in the evenings, ally casting repairs are one of my specialities but I can weld pretty much anything. PM me with your requirements.

Some of my services: (See my for sale threads)
Engine mount/chassis repair
Solid Beam Mounts BACK IN PRODUCTION
Harness bars
Posted 1st Jun 2010 at 23:30
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309btcc

**DODGY SELLER**

Location: england

Registered: 07 Jul 2009

Posts: 530

Status: Offline
Post #61
was on 48s m8 but 11mm lift cams same as nicks engine in the 205 rallye richard said it needs 48s to get the correct airflow as 45s struggle after 230ish bhp
Posted 1st Jun 2010 at 23:33
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daveyboy

aka Jim Davey

Location: Southampton

Registered: 01 Oct 2007

Posts: 8,648

Status: Offline
Post #62
309btcc wrote:
was on 48s m8 but 11mm lift cams same as nicks engine in the 205 rallye richard said it needs 48s to get the correct airflow as 45s struggle after 230ish bhp


Bummer, mine may have to go then.

________________________________________

R H Davey Welding Supplies. I sell new and used welding equipment in the Hampshire area. I take on welding jobs in the evenings, ally casting repairs are one of my specialities but I can weld pretty much anything. PM me with your requirements.

Some of my services: (See my for sale threads)
Engine mount/chassis repair
Solid Beam Mounts BACK IN PRODUCTION
Harness bars
Posted 1st Jun 2010 at 23:36
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309btcc

**DODGY SELLER**

Location: england

Registered: 07 Jul 2009

Posts: 530

Status: Offline
Post #63
no you can get your honed out too 45s mate
Posted 1st Jun 2010 at 23:47
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309btcc

**DODGY SELLER**

Location: england

Registered: 07 Jul 2009

Posts: 530

Status: Offline
Post #64
sorry my mistake for slagn off richard longman when the engine was set up on differant management and on a rolling road and not engine dyno.. and it didnt have the 13mm lift cams to make the 270bhp that it should have as colin advised that it would be a pig for road use thats why 11mm cams were fitted ....
Posted 2nd Jun 2010 at 00:19
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daveyboy

aka Jim Davey

Location: Southampton

Registered: 01 Oct 2007

Posts: 8,648

Status: Offline
Post #65
309btcc wrote:
no you can get your honed out too 45s mate


You can't, 48s are a different casting and the butterflies would all need changing too. I'm beginning to wish I bought those ones off Pete when I had the chance.

________________________________________

R H Davey Welding Supplies. I sell new and used welding equipment in the Hampshire area. I take on welding jobs in the evenings, ally casting repairs are one of my specialities but I can weld pretty much anything. PM me with your requirements.

Some of my services: (See my for sale threads)
Engine mount/chassis repair
Solid Beam Mounts BACK IN PRODUCTION
Harness bars
Posted 2nd Jun 2010 at 00:23
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matty_rallye

Senior User

Location: Devizes

Registered: 28 Oct 2005

Posts: 966

Status: Offline
Post #66
With regards to the inlet design there was a 2.1 16v xu build which Sandy was looking over (not a unit he'd built). There was a before and after rolling road session recorded with the inlet design the engine had been built with, and then with the revised inlet fitted and map adjusted accordingly. The difference was huge. I have attached the link to the thread. Shows how important the correct inlet design can be on an engine!

Clicky

________________________________________

2.1 16v 306 Rallye.
Posted 2nd Jun 2010 at 03:35
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daveyboy

aka Jim Davey

Location: Southampton

Registered: 01 Oct 2007

Posts: 8,648

Status: Offline
Post #67
matty_rallye wrote:
With regards to the inlet design there was a 2.1 16v xu build which Sandy was looking over (not a unit he'd built). There was a before and after rolling road session recorded with the inlet design the engine had been built with, and then with the revised inlet fitted and map adjusted accordingly. The difference was huge. I have attached the link to the thread. Shows how important the correct inlet design can be on an engine!

Clicky


Interesting reading, I wonder if it might be worth me giving him a call?

________________________________________

R H Davey Welding Supplies. I sell new and used welding equipment in the Hampshire area. I take on welding jobs in the evenings, ally casting repairs are one of my specialities but I can weld pretty much anything. PM me with your requirements.

Some of my services: (See my for sale threads)
Engine mount/chassis repair
Solid Beam Mounts BACK IN PRODUCTION
Harness bars
Posted 2nd Jun 2010 at 03:48
Profile
309btcc

**DODGY SELLER**

Location: england

Registered: 07 Jul 2009

Posts: 530

Status: Offline
Post #68
what is that about then jim
Posted 2nd Jun 2010 at 03:51
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daveyboy

aka Jim Davey

Location: Southampton

Registered: 01 Oct 2007

Posts: 8,648

Status: Offline
Post #69
309btcc wrote:
what is that about then jim


Im wondering wether or not to go in a new direction for my inlet manifold. Looks like there is some pretty compelling evidence that the Longmans/Jenvey one has some fairly serious flaws in it's design. If a different manifold design and a change of injector location can net a gain of 20 odd bhp then it's got to be worth looking at.

________________________________________

R H Davey Welding Supplies. I sell new and used welding equipment in the Hampshire area. I take on welding jobs in the evenings, ally casting repairs are one of my specialities but I can weld pretty much anything. PM me with your requirements.

Some of my services: (See my for sale threads)
Engine mount/chassis repair
Solid Beam Mounts BACK IN PRODUCTION
Harness bars
Posted 2nd Jun 2010 at 04:01
Profile
gtomi-6

Seasoned Pro

Location: southampton

Registered: 16 Jan 2009

Posts: 1,136

Status: Offline
Post #70
im sure nicks cams are 13mm lift

________________________________________

ph3 gti-6 china blue- mint condition
ph2 gti-6 nile blue K.I.A dec 2010
Posted 2nd Jun 2010 at 05:18
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daveyboy

aka Jim Davey

Location: Southampton

Registered: 01 Oct 2007

Posts: 8,648

Status: Offline
Post #71
gtomi-6 wrote:
im sure nicks cams are 13mm lift


Mine are 12.5mm so roughly 14% more lift than standard cams.

________________________________________

R H Davey Welding Supplies. I sell new and used welding equipment in the Hampshire area. I take on welding jobs in the evenings, ally casting repairs are one of my specialities but I can weld pretty much anything. PM me with your requirements.

Some of my services: (See my for sale threads)
Engine mount/chassis repair
Solid Beam Mounts BACK IN PRODUCTION
Harness bars
Posted 2nd Jun 2010 at 05:27
Profile
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

Registered: 27 Mar 2007

Posts: 25,838

Status: Offline
Post #72
ahhh yes, MOS's engine! I thought there must have been a comparison somewhere.

epic in a 205 Cool

________________________________________

need a part number? get on here - http://public.servicebox.peugeot.com

Bring on the Trumpets.

Posted 2nd Jun 2010 at 05:37
Profile
matty_rallye

Senior User

Location: Devizes

Registered: 28 Oct 2005

Posts: 966

Status: Offline
Post #73
daveyboy wrote:
matty_rallye wrote:
With regards to the inlet design there was a 2.1 16v xu build which Sandy was looking over (not a unit he'd built). There was a before and after rolling road session recorded with the inlet design the engine had been built with, and then with the revised inlet fitted and map adjusted accordingly. The difference was huge. I have attached the link to the thread. Shows how important the correct inlet design can be on an engine!

Clicky


Interesting reading, I wonder if it might be worth me giving him a call?


Send him a PM, he is registered on here i think. Would be worth giving him the build spec and current inlet design and see what he thinks. Could possibly make quite a difference.

I should keep quiet really, otherwise if you do another day at Combe i wont stand a chance!

________________________________________

2.1 16v 306 Rallye.
Posted 2nd Jun 2010 at 13:48
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daveyboy

aka Jim Davey

Location: Southampton

Registered: 01 Oct 2007

Posts: 8,648

Status: Offline
Post #74
matty_rallye wrote:
daveyboy wrote:
matty_rallye wrote:
With regards to the inlet design there was a 2.1 16v xu build which Sandy was looking over (not a unit he'd built). There was a before and after rolling road session recorded with the inlet design the engine had been built with, and then with the revised inlet fitted and map adjusted accordingly. The difference was huge. I have attached the link to the thread. Shows how important the correct inlet design can be on an engine!

Clicky


Interesting reading, I wonder if it might be worth me giving him a call?


Send him a PM, he is registered on here i think. Would be worth giving him the build spec and current inlet design and see what he thinks. Could possibly make quite a difference.

I should keep quiet really, otherwise if you do another day at Combe i wont stand a chance!


Ah, but your local knowledge must count for something, I've only managed about four laps there too. LOL

________________________________________

R H Davey Welding Supplies. I sell new and used welding equipment in the Hampshire area. I take on welding jobs in the evenings, ally casting repairs are one of my specialities but I can weld pretty much anything. PM me with your requirements.

Some of my services: (See my for sale threads)
Engine mount/chassis repair
Solid Beam Mounts BACK IN PRODUCTION
Harness bars
Posted 2nd Jun 2010 at 13:55
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welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

Registered: 27 Mar 2007

Posts: 25,838

Status: Offline
Post #75
Sandy

________________________________________

need a part number? get on here - http://public.servicebox.peugeot.com

Bring on the Trumpets.

Posted 2nd Jun 2010 at 14:10
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